Ep 14: Finding the Flavor in Low-Sodium Cooking with Chef Danielle Turner of SaltSanity.com
Say hello to Chef Danielle Turner, the mastermind behind Salt Sanity. After her husband's heart issues struck, Danielle took her classic training to a new level by retraining herself to find the flavor in food without all the salt.
Now Danielle is here to teach you through her The Food Lover's Guide to Low Sodium Living (with a 15% special discount for ENK podcast listeners) and Low Sodium YOUniversity, aimed at showing you how to reduce the salt and amp up the flavor.
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Follow Christine Van Bloem on Instagram @theemptynestkitchen and on Facebook @emptynestkitchen
Connect with Danielle Turner on her website, on Facebook @saltsanity1500 and on Instagram @saltsanity
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Christine Van Bloem: 0:23
thank you so much for joining us today. All right. So I have a wonderful chef on with me today. Chef Danielle Turner. Hello, Danielle. Thank you for joining me.
Chef Danielle Turner: 0:35
Hi, I'm so excited to be here. My first podcast appearance.
Christine Van Bloem: 0:38
I love it! I love it! I feel so lucky! Danielle and I were just talking, you know, we always do a little pregame before I hit record, and Danielle and I actually met a hundred years ago, even though we're both young and spry and fabulous. Back at a cooking school that used to be in Bethesda, Maryland called L'Academie de Cuisine. And we had taken a cookbook writing course, right? That was kind of what it wasn't really like writing. It was more about getting published.
Chef Danielle Turner: 1:11
it was. I felt like it was more of a depressant. Yes, yes,
Christine Van Bloem: 1:22
Her name's Virginia Willis. She's amazing. She's done an incredible journey. And like a book agent. And I came out of it just, I was depressed.
Chef Danielle Turner: 1:32
yeah. My other friend who is a friend now from that event, we've just kind of, that's how we bonded. I was
Christine Van Bloem: 1:38
Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner: 1:39
this is never going to happen.
Christine Van Bloem: 1:41
I, speaking of making it happen, this is really cool because Danielle and I have followed each other on social media for a while. And she's relatively close to where I live, about an hour away from I live, where I live. And. Danielle has kind of embraced this really interesting journey, especially for me, because you have a website called Salt Sanity, right? And it is about lower sodium living.
Chef Danielle Turner: 2:11
Absolutely. Absolutely. So it's it started, we were not a low sodium family. I am a classically trained French chef. So salt was my homeboy,
Christine Van Bloem: 2:24
Yes,
Chef Danielle Turner: 2:26
when in doubt, salt it like that.
Christine Van Bloem: 2:28
yes. That's, that's where I still live.
Chef Danielle Turner: 2:32
Yeah, so it was just quite a shock. I had a perfectly healthy husband who had a massive heart attack, they call it a widow maker, at 45.
Christine Van Bloem: 2:41
I had.
Chef Danielle Turner: 2:42
Oh my gosh, okay, so you know,
Christine Van Bloem: 2:44
Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner: 2:44
It's very scary because it doesn't, or his, didn't present like a typical heart attack. He, we were, we were doing a mud run. First mistake. Don't do outdoor things. No. And he is, has always been a runner since high school. And so he was finished and actually waiting for me. And when I got to him, he was like, Oh, I don't feel well. I'm like, okay, well let's go get your, you know, your giant turkey leg and you know, we'll get some water and you'll feel better. And then he said, I'm cold. And it was May. And he's never cold and I could tell something was off. And so thank God we were there and there was a first aid tent. And I said, can you make it to the tent over there? And he said, yes. And they had all the equipment. They took them up to an EKG. They were wonderful and lied to me when I kind of whispered, is he having a heart attack? And the woman was like, but it was all over her face. And they ended up medevacking him. We were out in the woods somewhere in Maryland to Washington hospital center. And. He had a stint put in and you know, we were good. That was in 2012 and then in 2018 is when I started the website or got the idea for the website because he was diagnosed with congestive heart failure. And that's when they were like, Oh, you got to lower your salt to 1500 milligrams a day. And I didn't even know what that really meant.
Christine Van Bloem: 4:05
I don't know what that means. And I, you know, I also have had a widowmaker heart attack and I don't have congestive heart failure, which is I'm super grateful for. But they talk to you when, when you go through a heart event and you're in the hospital, the food is, is really terrible, right? And all of a sudden, you're somebody, and I'm sure your husband, what's your husband's name?
Chef Danielle Turner: 4:32
Rob,
Christine Van Bloem: 4:33
But you have a, you have a fun nickname for him.
Chef Danielle Turner: 4:36
I do. We call him Handsome Rob. He had a job where there were two Robs in the office and someone rushed in and said, we've got, we need blah, blah, blah. Where's Rob? And someone said, well, which one? And they said, Handsome Rob. And the other Rob was in the office and was like, Hey.
Christine Van Bloem: 4:50
Yeah. I love that. I love that nickname. But you're, you're there. And I'm sure Rob is used to eating good food, having you just, right? My husband's the same way. He's, they're spoiled. These gentlemen are spoiled, right? And then He's used to good food. I'm used to good food. And all of a sudden, there's no salt. And Danielle and I both know that the thing they teach you in culinary school is how to season, right? It's when in doubt, add salt, right? And I'm really good at salt. I'll bet you're really good
Chef Danielle Turner: 5:28
Yeah, I used to be. I'm not sure anymore.
Christine Van Bloem: 5:30
Yeah. Well, so this is so interesting to me because you say 1500 milligrams and this means This means nothing to me. I have nothing to put into perspective and I'm a heart patient. Right?
Chef Danielle Turner: 5:45
And that's most people when you're released from the hospital. And that's why I started it because I thought you could actually be making yourself a little sicker just by not understanding the information that they're giving to you. When the guy kind of just said offhandedly, like when they were releasing him after the congestive heart failure diagnosis, I and they should really rename that because it sounds so
Christine Van Bloem: 6:06
it sounds like game over. It
Chef Danielle Turner: 6:08
Yeah, like your heart's going to stop
Christine Van Bloem: 6:10
over and
Chef Danielle Turner: 6:10
and that's not, not what it is at all. But he just kind of offhandedly said, Oh, you know, he needs a low sodium diet, 1500 milligrams a day. And I was like, okay. So that's when I had to go into like Google research mode. Like this is my new job. What does that mean? And I think that the The RDA, the recommended daily allowance for sodium, it's like 3, 000 milligrams a day and most Americans are eating about twice that without even realizing it. Because people think when you have to reduce salt it means the salt that you're adding to the food. 70 percent of the salt that people consume in the United States is from processed foods. So it's not even because you're over salted. You do need to monitor that but it's really from the processed food. So if you're eating anything in a can. in a box, anything that's already prepared or frozen. They're adding sodium into it for a couple of reasons. One, for flavor, but two, it acts as a preservative. It can stay, it can extend its shelf life if you're adding that in there. And then we get used to that taste
Christine Van Bloem: 7:14
Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner: 7:15
and it's, it's a cycle. So anything that doesn't have that, you know, it's like, you don't really know what a carrot tastes like. You know, a salty carrot tastes like. if you're buying them packaged and prepared. So it was, for me, it was just about, okay, well, I, I'm pretty much a scratch cook anyway. We didn't do a lot of the box and cans, but it's still hard because your food does not taste the same
Christine Van Bloem: 7:37
It doesn't.
Chef Danielle Turner: 7:39
the amount of salt. So it's just been a, a learning process of, we're still going to eat good food because I refuse to give that up. But I have to figure out a way to make it taste as best as possible without all the sodium.
Christine Van Bloem: 7:51
Is it also, Have you retrained your palates?
Chef Danielle Turner: 7:57
Absolutely, because now, if I eat a regular potato chip, and not like a, the Lay's Lightly Salted, which is our house potato chip,
Christine Van Bloem: 8:05
Okay. Okay.
Chef Danielle Turner: 8:07
like my tongue is burning and I'm like, you know, it's too much. It's, it's, it happens far faster than I think most people think. But if you just stick with it, like after a couple weeks, a month, you're gonna notice a huge difference. And those things that you used to eat all the, yeah, it's really fast. It's really fast. And the trick is that not to just kind of accept that food's going to taste poorly, but to learn all the ways that you can build flavor without adding salt or without adding a lot of salt. I still cook with salt in much smaller quantities than before. And I count every grain so that every milligram so that I can make sure he stays within, within his daily limit as much as possible. And if we go out to dinner, we obviously can't control the salt. So You know, we don't do that all the time, but we still live a normal life. We go out to dinner, we eat with friends. We just try to, you know, balance what, and how he's eating.
Christine Van Bloem: 8:56
That's so smart. I, you know, I think that if I was taking care of someone else, I would probably pay a lot more attention to it than for myself, right? Because I think as we, as we're Empty Nester, and you're an Empty Nester.
Chef Danielle Turner: 9:15
Yes.
Christine Van Bloem: 9:16
have a daughter in college.
Chef Danielle Turner: 9:18
A daughter who is finishing up her sophomore year. So she's coming home in three weeks.
Christine Van Bloem: 9:23
Oh, yeah, that's an exciting time.
Chef Danielle Turner: 9:26
it's exciting, and then, you know, they're here and they're leaving their stuff around. Making a mess, and you're like, when are you going back to school?
Christine Van Bloem: 9:33
daughter has, my kids both live on their own and she's got a cute apartment and the apartment's together and she comes home as like a hurricane and she's, she's grown. She's 25. Light of my life. Hurricane. Hurricane. I have to remake the book. Bed. I had, you know, there's stuff everywhere. It's a crazy thing. But I don't want to leave the salt. I'm just, I know you've got that coming and that is an exciting time in your life when you've got the kid coming back and leaving. So does, does she eat low sodium as well? Because that's how
Chef Danielle Turner: 10:07
Everybody, everybody eats low sodium. And we have salt, so if there's something, you know, You need to add some to your own plate, you're welcome to do that. But she's gotten used to it. Like, she doesn't know a difference because it's been, you know, a few years.
Christine Van Bloem: 10:20
okay. All right, so listen, here's what I want you to do for me. I want you to walk me through like something that you make where you've really, where you're really coming back sodium and how you're making it taste Because I, I know you're talented. I know you've got good training. I know you've been in this game for a while. So how do you, because I'm hoping to learn from you right here. How do you take
Chef Danielle Turner: 10:47
Absolutely.
Christine Van Bloem: 10:48
And make, you know, how do you make great food with a lower sodium level?
Chef Danielle Turner: 10:54
Okay, so the first thing that I do if I find a recipe that I want to make is I look at the ingredients list and I'm able to identify the ingredients. Those are the things that are typically high in sodium. Everybody should know, everybody who's worried about salt should learn about the salty six. And those are the six foods that everybody loves that are full of sodium.
Christine Van Bloem: 11:14
Okay. Give me that list.
Chef Danielle Turner: 11:16
if I can remember them.
Christine Van Bloem: 11:17
In my head, I'm like potato chips, pretzels.
Chef Danielle Turner: 11:21
and see, those aren't even on the
Christine Van Bloem: 11:23
They're not even on the list. All
Chef Danielle Turner: 11:25
No, because it comes in ways that you don't suspect and that is the problem. It's the things that we're not thinking about. You think about things that you think of as being salty, like chips and pretzels, but those are not the things that are as problematic. So, pizza. Wouldn't
Christine Van Bloem: 11:41
taught a pizza class last night.
Chef Danielle Turner: 11:43
right? But pizza, and it's because of the sodium that's in bread, which is another thing on the salty six list. Bread, it can be up to 300 milligrams of sodium in one slice. So if you're at 1500, yes, a sandwich, bread, pizza, and sandwiches, I think are the three that were the most shocking for me because any kind of processed meat,
Christine Van Bloem: 12:08
Sure. Sure.
Chef Danielle Turner: 12:10
can find now I think Boar's Head has a line of lower sodium or reduced sodium that makes it doable to have a turkey sandwich safely. Poultry. And that might seem weird. Like why poultry? Because poultry is often injected with a saline solution before it's sold. So that's to plump it up so it weighs, so it weighs more and to give it a color. Yeah. So you have to be very I'm a top notch label reader. Like you have to start reading labels. So a grocery, in the beginning, the grocery store, it would take me forever because I'm reading everything. Now I kind of know. But you have to check the labels. And when you find a product that you love that is lower or reduced sodium, you have to check it every time you buy it because those recipes change constantly and they don't have to inform you of that. So you're buying something thinking, Oh, I always get this. It's great. And then you look at it and it's like, Oh wait, it, you know, something changed. But when you identify those items in a recipe or the things that are the highest in sodium, then we want to look for an alternative. So there are lower sodium. Mm hmm.
Christine Van Bloem: 13:12
on a sec. I want to go back to this chicken thing because you are freaking me out right now. So you're not talking like a Costco already roasted chicken. You're talking raw chicken in the package. Just if I'm going to get, I, I actually love the boneless skinless thighs. Those are important in my journey right
Chef Danielle Turner: 13:34
yes
Christine Van Bloem: 13:35
but you were saying even look at that to see. If there's sodium in it. Whoa. I never even thought of that.
Chef Danielle Turner: 13:44
and most, why would you? Most people wouldn't. The app, on average fresh chicken, that means it's not in the freezer section with a sauce
Christine Van Bloem: 13:52
Right.
Chef Danielle Turner: 13:53
cooked already, but just a fresh chicken, your chicken thighs, chicken breast, whatever. Typically between 50 and 80 milligrams of sodium per four ounces. But with that saline solution injected, it can be, you know, 150 milligrams per four ounces. Again, it seems like small amounts, but is that where you want to spend your sodium? Is my husband going to want to have this chicken breast that's filled with the saline solution or is he going to Want me to be able to put a little salt on his potatoes at dinner. Like, so it's, it's a balance, but it's things that you don't know and you would never, ever expect. What's he got? Pizza, any fresh poultry, sandwiches, breads and rolls, cold cuts, and cured meats. Oh, canned soups. Almost
Christine Van Bloem: 14:38
now that one I knew. That one I knew and I don't, I don't know if you know this, but I'm kind of on a tinned fish journey as well. You know how the tinned fish is like really the thing right now? I just got this fabulous gift, but I have to be really judicious because I know that the tinned fish is loaded with salt.
Chef Danielle Turner: 15:00
Yeah.
Christine Van Bloem: 15:00
That's an easy,
Chef Danielle Turner: 15:01
But again, you know that. It's just the things, I call it the sneaky sodium words, things that you would not expect that bread is, that was heartbreaking for me. Bread and cheese, I was like, what? But yeah.
Christine Van Bloem: 15:14
as I plan my lunch.
Chef Danielle Turner: 15:16
right, people, people need to get familiar with what they're eating and not just like the name brand. You've got to get into those labels, which can be such a challenge. Because it's like, it's learning another language basically. But and being able to look for in the ingredients list, the things that also aren't called sodium, but are sodium, MSG, things like that. It's best to, this is, people talk about shopping the perimeter of the grocery store. And if you're on a low sodium lifestyle, highly recommend that because basically anything else, you're kind of at the mercy of the manufacturers. And if you, depending on where you are, I'm in a, I'm in the city, I can find pretty much everything, a low sodium version of it. But if you're in a rural part of place or someplace that's not as populated, it can be hard. I can go and get cans of no salt added beans or no salt added tomato paste or a can of low sodium soup. Although I would just make the soup, but there are lots of places around the country where those things are not accessible. But so the first thing, and this is a long answer to your question.
Christine Van Bloem: 16:17
No, I love
Chef Danielle Turner: 16:18
a recipe. I find the ingredients that are higher in sodium and figure out how I can replace them. So if it's a chicken stock or broth, another thing that's really high in sodium, I'm going to get the no salt added or the unsalted version of that. One of the things that we really love is Asian food. I don't care if it's Thai, Chinese, like we love Asian food. Soy sauce is bananas with the sodium.
Christine Van Bloem: 16:40
I know that soy sauce is crazy. Oh,
Chef Danielle Turner: 16:46
of that and it's like 1, 200 milligrams. It's like your whole day in a tablespoon. It's ridiculous. Even the reduced sodium, and that's another thing. People, I want people to learn the difference between reduced sodium and lower sodium. Reduced and lower sodium, those products are not necessarily low sodium. They just have less sodium than the regular version of it. It can still be really high in sodium. That's why it's important I think for people to ask their doctors when they say you need to eat low sodium. What does that mean? What's my number?
Christine Van Bloem: 17:16
yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner: 17:17
do I need to stay within so that you have some clear parameters there? Because it's it can get murky and our food system is not set up for ease of use for customers who are looking for for those types of things.
Christine Van Bloem: 17:29
That's so interesting. All right, so what kind of, what kind of salt substitutes are you using? And I don't mean fake salt, but like how are you building flavor
Chef Danielle Turner: 17:44
Okay.
Christine Van Bloem: 17:44
to make up for the lack of salt?
Chef Danielle Turner: 17:47
just relying on other things like acid. So instead of salt, we are lemon juice, lime juice, vinegars. When I make, I make a pot of chicken noodle soup almost every other week because my husband is a creature of habit. He wants that for lunch every day.
Christine Van Bloem: 18:02
Okay, great.
Chef Danielle Turner: 18:03
when it's, when it's hot outside, I'm like, you want soup? But So when I'm done with this soup, it's always a squeeze of a half of lemon juice in there. And you might think, well, it's not, what is that going to do? It makes a difference.
Christine Van Bloem: 18:13
It makes a difference.
Chef Danielle Turner: 18:14
does very much the same as salt. It enhances the flavor of whatever it is that you're cooking. Doesn't do it to the same level as salt, but it's a good step, a good stepping stone. Other things that I use umami powder, which is usually just like a dried mushroom powder.
Christine Van Bloem: 18:29
Yeah, I know they have one at Trader Joe's in the spice section. I'm, I'm up for a TJ run soon.
Chef Danielle Turner: 18:35
yeah, if it's something that's a little flat, I'm going to stir a little bit of that in there. And then things like nutritional yeast. Like I used to, I make popcorn. He likes his cheesy popcorn. But most of it's out of, out of reach. Although the skinny pop is pretty good. But I make the popcorn. I do a little bit of butter and a little bit of nutritional yeast. And it's just, it's not an active yeast, but it, it tastes like cheese. And I don't know why it tastes like Parmesan
Christine Van Bloem: 18:59
Yeah. I, I have some, so I am new to the nutritional yeast, right? It's a new
Chef Danielle Turner: 19:06
And my, my favorite thing cause I said we like Asian food. So soy sauce is kind of off the, off the table for us, but I've discovered that coconut aminos taste like soy sauce. Don't even know what an amino is or
Christine Van Bloem: 19:21
Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner: 19:21
of the coconut it comes from, but somebody recommended it. It's significantly less sodium, but it still tastes like soy sauce. So I use that instead. Not at all. That's why I'm confused.
Christine Van Bloem: 19:35
That's so interesting.
Chef Danielle Turner: 19:37
The science part, I don't want to get into it cause I don't even know what it is. And I don't probably don't want to know what it is, but it's low in sodium and it makes my, you know, my shrimp fried rice or my vegetable fried rice tastes like what we're used to. And then I, you find other ingredients that kind of give things a depth of flavor without sodium. Worcestershire sauce. Most of those, yes, most of those are, what did I make last night that I put that in? I can't remember, but it was like, Oh, this is a little off. I
Christine Van Bloem: 20:08
with Worcestershire. And I can't say the word correctly either. It's, I grew up on it. It is my total comfort food. It
Chef Danielle Turner: 20:17
I can see that. I can.
Christine Van Bloem: 20:19
It's good. It's good. All right, so you'll add in the Worcestershire.
Chef Danielle Turner: 20:24
Yes, that stuff. So I just look for things like that. And then my spice cabinet is overflowing. You know, I lean heavily on herbs and spices. Fresh when I can. Keep them alive long enough, but certainly just lots of spices and there's really good low salt free seasonings besides Mrs. Dash. I mean, if you google that, you could spend hours on Amazon and beyond. Everybody has, you know, a salt free seasoning company. So there's lots of, of, and some of them are really good. And that's another thing. Check your spices. Low sodium friends, check your spices because some of them have sodium, even though they're not labeled sodium. So you always
Christine Van Bloem: 21:04
I'm going to look at every
Chef Danielle Turner: 21:06
Garlic powder, chili powder. Yeah. It's, it's really alarming. Yeah. If, if, if, if the spice has something in it more than just the spice, it's supposed to have a nutrition label on it and that should give you the, the sodium amount.
Christine Van Bloem: 21:22
Alright. So, first of all, when you said acid, that's such a chef y answer. I
Chef Danielle Turner: 21:27
know.
Christine Van Bloem: 21:28
that because I say the same thing and people look at me, I think now
Chef Danielle Turner: 21:32
what are you talking about?
Christine Van Bloem: 21:34
yeah, people are a little more informed and all of that, they'll get into oh, it needs a little acid.
Chef Danielle Turner: 21:39
Right.
Christine Van Bloem: 21:40
so acid. The umami powder, and you can find that lots of places, but you can also find it in the spice aisle at Trader Joe's.
Chef Danielle Turner: 21:50
Yes.
Christine Van Bloem: 21:51
The coconut aminos, I know they have those at Trader Joe's. I wonder if they have those, are they? So like at a Wegmans?
Chef Danielle Turner: 22:00
Yeah, at Wegmans, I get them at Safeway and Giant. Yeah, they
Christine Van Bloem: 22:03
Really, and, and nutritional yeast, I mean, you can find that everywhere now. You used to have to go to like, the Whole Foods Co op sort of place to, to get it. I have a shaker of it that I just picked up. I think I picked it up at Wegmans, because it's uncharted territory for me, right? It's uncharted
Chef Danielle Turner: 22:23
Yeah, it's new. It's very,
Christine Van Bloem: 22:26
it's exciting.
Chef Danielle Turner: 22:28
overwhelming too because I remember the first time I went to the grocery store, I almost cried because I was just like, nothing I normally buy. I can't buy the same ketchup we bought before. Everything has to be different. So it's a, a huge a huge shift. It is, but it is possible. We still eat well, we still eat out, we still travel, we still do all the things you can do. It. It's just a, it's an investment of time and energy and you know, I always tell my husband, you know, we've gotta do this because life tastes better than salt. Like, you need to be alive. Yeah.
Christine Van Bloem: 23:01
I'm like making a sad face, but I'm also going, it's totally true, right? Do you remember that whole oh gosh, I think it was back in the 90s when it was nothing tastes as good as skinny feels. I mean, now you need therapy for that kind of
Chef Danielle Turner: 23:17
Right.
Christine Van Bloem: 23:18
But I think that your, you know, life tastes better than, you know, I love that. I think that's really good. Well, I'm getting ready to take, and this is something you might be interested in their, the local community college where I live has a new culinary medicine program, and it's for food professionals. It's for people, either dieticians or people that have worked in food or things of that nature, and I'm very excited, and I know that Low sodium is a part of that, so I feel like I can take some of this info and I'm totally going to pick up coconut aminos today, just so you know.
Chef Danielle Turner: 24:04
Get some of those.
Christine Van Bloem: 24:05
How do you use those? Are they, is it liquid?
Chef Danielle Turner: 24:09
Yes. I can. Look,
Christine Van Bloem: 24:15
aminos are a liquid that are gonna add more flavor. You can hear Danielle wrestling around. Oh, it's in like a, a soy sauce
Chef Danielle Turner: 24:24
Yeah. It looks like soy sauce. Yeah. Soy free sauce alternative. Yep. And it has, for one tablespoon, 270 milligrams of sodium, which is still kind of high, but it's better than 900. Mm
Christine Van Bloem: 24:39
I see, so your website is saltsanity. com.
Chef Danielle Turner: 24:44
hmm. Yes.
Christine Van Bloem: 24:45
And so I was going all through your website, looking at it, and you have some really interesting things that you offer. Tell me about the Low Sodium U University. Mm
Chef Danielle Turner: 24:57
Oh, Low Sodium University. That's why a university. This is a new thing we're doing and it's just a monthly cooking live, cooking live on zoom cooking class once a month. And it's just sharing not just the recipes cause I think the recipes are good, but I like to share a lot of the things that I've been you know, talking about today, all the tips and tricks, tricks, the things that people don't think about the things that you don't know, the things that even I as like a food professional, I had no idea how many milligrams of sodium or anything and I didn't, didn't think about it. So we're doing that and it's been a great fun. What I have found is people are almost desperate for information because our health professionals are not always doing their best at giving people the guidance that they might need.
Christine Van Bloem: 25:45
yeah. Well, I
Chef Danielle Turner: 25:46
to a dietician or a nutritionist, you know.
Christine Van Bloem: 25:48
Yeah,
Chef Danielle Turner: 25:49
so I
Christine Van Bloem: 25:51
you have to do that. Like, your cardiologist isn't going to be able to give, he or she has bigger fish to fry, so to
Chef Danielle Turner: 25:59
But I think part of the package should be, You've had a heart event. We need you to alter your diet. I can't tell you what to do, but here's a referral for a nutritionist or a dietitian. Or here's, here's the thing that I'm manifesting for this year. I wrote a digital guide that's going to be a print guide. It's called the Food Lover's Guide to Low Sodium Living. And it kind of walks through a lot of what I've talked to here.
Christine Van Bloem: 26:22
So great.
Chef Danielle Turner: 26:24
And you can find that on the website as well. But it's like literally like the little Bible, everything, all the questions I had, it includes like the six questions. Everybody should ask their doctor when they've been diagnosed, how you can stock your low sodium kitchen. And then the last thing, I encourage people to find community because it's hard, especially if you're the only one in a family, if your family's not on board, it's really hard you know, to stick, to stick to that. So there's lots of great Facebook groups. If you check it, a lot of the hospitals have free classes on things like this. So it's just a, community I think is an important part.
Christine Van Bloem: 27:00
that's so, that's so key. You know, part of my whole thing is developing community and connecting through food and cooking, right? And especially, I think, as we get older, we're having more of these things, right? So the low sodium, if, if it's not you having something, It's perhaps your partner who is having an issue with something and I'm not a cook two meals kind of gal, right? I'm, I'm gonna do a single meal, right? So it's, it's that community and that connection because you will have to make a change as well or I do the cooking so whatever I cook my husband's gonna eat. If it's low sodium then so be it, right? He'll be fine with that. He
Chef Danielle Turner: 27:49
The same. I'm very lucky to have my husband and my daughter are like, are going to eat whatever I put in front of them. So that part has been hard. But there are a lot of people, you get into these Facebook groups and you see people are like, I don't know what to do, my family won't eat, most of the time they don't like the food, they're telling me it's not a big deal, and I can just eat regular. So it's very hard and can literally be bad for your health if, you know, you're not taking care of yourself. So it's important if you can't find that in your house. Which really infuriates me because we should take care of our people. But you know, find it online or find it somewhere because this is a, this is a tricky path, you know, to watch. And I recognize like the gift that I had just with my cooking knowledge and the ability to kind of pivot. And it's a hard pivot into something else, but it's
Christine Van Bloem: 28:35
do you have a Facebook group yourself?
Chef Danielle Turner: 28:39
Do I don't have a Facebook group now?
Christine Van Bloem: 28:41
Oh, you totally should.
Chef Danielle Turner: 28:43
I think about that, and then part of me is like, that's one more thing to manage, and
Christine Van Bloem: 28:47
Yeah. Yeah. I hear you.
Chef Danielle Turner: 28:49
But you, you are exactly right.
Christine Van Bloem: 28:52
Because finding, finding that place, you know, and, and sharing, I, I will say as a cooking instructor, and I think you're probably the same way, because we have taught thousands of classes, right? We've taught to thousands of people, the whole thing. And what people really love is The knowledge that comes out in those little tips and tricks and the fact that you've expanded that to this low sodium world. I just, I think it's so cool. I just think it's so cool. And I will say you gave me a touch of hope here because boy do I love salt when you said it's a couple of weeks to a month to retrain your palate.
Chef Danielle Turner: 29:36
Yeah. And again, I still use salt. You're never going to get me to eat a mashed potato that doesn't have some salt in it. Nobody should be
Christine Van Bloem: 29:45
That's like a
Chef Danielle Turner: 29:46
embracing it. So we've managed that. So I know if I'm going to make something that's kind of on the higher end, then all the side dish is going to be like a salad with a homemade dressing because the bottle dressings are notoriously high too. But yeah, it's balanced and it's possible, but it does require a lot of time. And I recognize the privilege that I have, that I have the time to do that. And not everybody does. So I'm, I'm just trying to create a resource. So we don't do frozen dinners in our house, but I know that they are essential for people who are busy and still want to eat healthy. So I will share things like, here's a list of the lowest sodium frozen pizzas or the lowest sodium, you know frozen meals you can buy. It's just, I just want the website to be just a resource. We got a question about it, go here. And if we don't know, we're linking you to someone who does.
Christine Van Bloem: 30:30
Oh, that's so, it's so good. It, you're so good, Danielle. Alright, so you've got the monthly class that you're offering. Is that a set day, like the third Sunday,
Chef Danielle Turner: 30:42
Always the last Wednesday of the month.
Christine Van Bloem: 30:46
Fantastic.
Chef Danielle Turner: 30:47
Yeah, from six to seven and it's one hour because people are busy. It's one hour but I jam pack it with so much information. You get recipes before they hit the website. You get the ability to ask me questions which, you know, is probably my favorite part. So yeah, we have a lot of fun.
Christine Van Bloem: 31:04
I love the online teaching. I love it. I, I cannot, it is, and I loved owning a school. It was wonderful and being face to face, but I, with people cooking in their own kitchens, with their own ingredients and their own equipment and then having a trained professional, sorry I'm on a soapbox, but having a trained professional there. When I taught this pizza class yesterday, the one group, I, I don't know if maybe they hadn't used quite as much flour, but I could see their dough and I could walk them through, okay now you're
Chef Danielle Turner: 31:44
Something you can't get from a cookbook.
Christine Van Bloem: 31:47
right? And at the end she said we never would have. Figured it out if you weren't there with us. And I'm like, yes! So you've got your monthly class jam
Chef Danielle Turner: 31:59
And then, yes, jam packed and lots of fun. And oh, The Food Lover's Guide to Low Sodium Living, which is everybody on a low sodium diet should do that. People who listen to your podcast, if they want to buy that and they enter the code EmptyNest, they're going to get 15 percent off.
Christine Van Bloem: 32:14
What? Okay. All right, Danielle. You are my first, like, here's a discount. I love
Chef Danielle Turner: 32:21
Here's the deal, just Empty Nest, that's all I have to do is type that in and it's delivered, it's a digital book so it comes right to your email inbox and it's searchable and it has, this is the best part, my favorite part, is it has links. So if I mention something, like I just talked about, you know, if you're, you need a frozen, like there's links to all of the things, there's links to lots of resources, not just on my website. Okay, good. across the board. Just
Christine Van Bloem: 32:45
I'm gonna get a copy myself!
Chef Danielle Turner: 32:47
of useful information. Grab it. It's really, really helpful. And I not to toot my own horn, but I will a
Christine Van Bloem: 32:52
Tune
Chef Danielle Turner: 32:52
but one of my followers is a heart failure patient. She's also a nurse. And so she reached out to me and was like, Oh, I love this website. You've got to do it. And I sent her the book and she was like, this is going to be so helpful. So what I'm trying to manifest for the rest of the year, by the end of the year is to figure out a way to get this into the hands of The medical professionals who are treating these folks just to say, Hey, here's something. It's not expensive. It's 14. 99. It'll never be more than that. I almost always have some kind of a discount or sale going because it's important to me that it's accessible. It's, if I had had that in the beginning, it would have saved me so much distress and kind of angst of what are we going to eat? Yeah.
Christine Van Bloem: 33:37
a resource from someone who really knows food, right? Really knows food and food just plays into health. I mean back in the day as folks of a certain age, right? It's come so far from The 80s, the 70s and the 80s. And I mean, just every day is more advanced than the last. So having a resource like that is, so fantastic. I can't wait to share that with people.
Chef Danielle Turner: 34:10
And I, I'm always very clear. There's no medical advice in there. I am not a doctor. No one should take any medical advice from me. But this is just, I know, I don't know medicine, but I do know food. And now I know how to make low sodium food taste really good. So that's, those are the things that I'm sharing. I give suggestions like, ask your doctor X, Y, and Z. But I did, you know, I'm not in any way equipped to tell anybody how
Christine Van Bloem: 34:34
I'm, I'm the same way and it's, I'm actually part of a group called Women Heart for women who have had, we call them heart events. Right? We'll call it that. And when I went to the Mayo Clinic to do training for this, They're like, can you give medical advice? And everybody's like, no,
Chef Danielle Turner: 34:56
No.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 34:57
I love the idea of you getting this book into the hands of cardiac patients. I really do. I just think it's so good.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 35:08
That's the goal. That's what we're, we're trying to work on for the rest of the year.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 35:12
I'm doing all the manifesting,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 35:14
on the, yes, on the vision board. That's what we're doing.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 35:17
Okay, do you have an actual vision board?
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 35:20
No, I create one in Canva and just have it in my phone and on my thing so I can look at, but we just moved into a new house and I'm trying to figure out a place because I'm like, I want an actual board because the one that I can just kind of see without having to let me go and do my photos and find it or let me, I want to have a visual representation of that. Mm
Christine Van Bloem (2): 35:46
year. She's incredible. She's the best. Just one of those people and she does hers in a book. She gets so think about that.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 35:55
That's a really good idea.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 35:57
my friend, Julie, I'll give her a shout out. She's incredible. She takes, you know, those journals you get without a calendar or anything, either lines or blank pages. And she just goes through and adds things as it, as it
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 36:13
I love that.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 36:15
Isn't that smart?
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 36:17
Right. Cause I'm like, Oh, I could put it, you know, my kitchen is my office. So I'm like, I could put it on the wall, but then I don't want everyone who comes in here checking out my vision board. So that's an excellent solution to
Christine Van Bloem (2): 36:27
because it's a private thing.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 36:29
It is. It is.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 36:31
It is, and some people are like, a vision board. But I am gonna tell you back in Oh my gosh, I think it was like 2008. Oh no, had to be like 13. I wrote down, I was doing some course and I wrote down, here are my goals for the next five years. And I, I actually wrote them down and then I forgot all about it. And then I found it like seven years after it. Can I tell you I got every single one.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:01
I love that they say that your chances of like completing, reaching a goal. Go up exponentially if you just write it down.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 37:08
It, it was, I blew myself away. I couldn't even believe I had done that. You know, and now that we're in the we don't care phase,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:18
Right. The best phase.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 37:20
the most glorious phase, right? It's so much fun. I've never felt better in my life than I feel like right now, today.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:32
And I think that people should tell us that when we're in our, well, they probably do and we don't believe them because when we're in our twenties. We think we know everything, but, but
Christine Van Bloem (2): 37:40
Well, we do know everything.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:42
you're exactly right. It's just, it's so freeing and just like lots of exhaling,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 37:49
it's lots of exhaling. I love it. But then we have to handle the low sodium eating. You know,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:56
And then the physical therapy,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 37:58
and
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 37:58
I have arthritis in my knee.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 38:00
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I have been working out like a fiend. Because I, I like to say I'm a woman of substance. Right? I'm a, yeah. Ha ha ha. Yes, indeed. And, and I have been, you know, going to Pilates, by the way, that SNL. Did you see the SNL thing on Pilates?
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 38:20
No, I'll have to look it
Christine Van Bloem (2): 38:22
Look it up. It's hilarious and a thousand percent accurate. And then I ride a bike here and I love it. I'm like, I'm feeling mentally better than I've ever felt.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 38:36
Yeah, and it's nice for me when my daughter left, it was like, Oh, maybe it would be okay if I did something that was just something fun that I want to do. So I've been taking, I take a weekly tennis class from the parks. I love it. It's so fun. And Certainly a departure. Gives me a little extra PT for my knees.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 38:54
Yes, yes,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 38:56
great. And then I work out at home with like my weights and whatnot with an app that I use that I love. But it's these are good times. And I'm just so grateful because I know, you know, we're all going to have ups and downs. But it's just nice to be in a place where I'm not stressed out. I'm not carting kids around, I'll say. You know, it's like, you love them. Love, like, my daughter is my favorite thing in the world, the,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 39:20
yes, of course,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 39:21
my life. But people are like, were you sad when she left? And I, there was about a 90 second period when we got back into D. C. after we dropped her off at school where I was like, oh, everything's stupid because, you know, Ryan's not here. And then I was like, but wait. I can do whatever I want. I don't have to make dinner every night. It's just been, it's wonderful, and she's thriving, and that makes it a lot easier for me to thrive, so I am all about this Empty Nest era, as the young people say.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 39:52
I love it. I love it so much because the wheels haven't, I mean, listen, I had a heart attack, my husband had a stroke, the knees, the things, so maybe the wheels have come off the bus a little bit. I don't know. But we're recovered, you know, we're feeling so good. And I think I often think about my mom at this age, right? I'm 56. So I think about my mom being 56. And I mean, bless her heart. Boy, do I love that woman. But It's so different. It was so different than what that was, and I'm kind of on this campaign, too. You know the whole thing about how middle aged women become invisible, how older women become invisible, and there's, there's a really cool trend, you might have seen it, where younger women in their 20s will ask questions of women in their 50s and 60s. And it, if you are looking for like a positive, like some love in your life, something that just feels really good, look, just do a little Google search for it because they ask very earnest questions. And You know, women our age, we're, we'll spill the beans. We don't care.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 41:09
I will talk to anybody about anything.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 41:13
I love, and I saw someone say something about, Well, you become invisible so, you know, it's easier to do things. And one of the little girlies in her 20s was like, Well, I won't be invisible. And I'm like, Oh, sweetie, it doesn't have anything to do with
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 41:29
Just wait, just you wait,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 41:33
It's like, do you think, do you think the invisibility is something we are asking, but something we're making happen? But I find, I'm finding my voice in the invisibility, I think. And the only person I care about seeing, I, Me, I think, are the other Empty Nester women right now. I think maybe, oh, I feel like I'm getting deep. I feel like maybe that's why I started this, because Empty Nest women are so fantastic. Just like you. Exciting and vibrant and cute and
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 42:12
We're still doing all the things.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 42:15
doing all the things. Only now we're not spread so thin.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 42:20
Absolutely. And that is such a gift in so many ways. And it makes me like, I talked to my daughter about that a lot. Cause I mean, she's 20, she's about to be 21, but I'm like, I need to make sure she knows this so that she can maybe skip some of that because you're running yourself ragged for like 15, 20 years and it's not, you don't have to do that to live a full life. You don't have to do that to raise great kids. You don't have to do that to eat well. So yeah.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 42:47
Way to bring it back around, Danielle. I love it. Love it! All right,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 42:52
the podcast. I gotta tell you.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 42:54
oh my gosh, you're so sweet to me. I, I am just having so much fun. I have so much fun doing this and I'm meeting such interesting people, like folks like you that I have admired from a distance. I'm really meeting the neatest people that are doing the coolest work and really have something to offer and it's just the most fun thing ever. So thank you.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 43:21
You're welcome. It's great here.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 43:22
everyone.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 43:23
I am going to tell everyone, cause this is my first podcast. So everybody has to know attention must be paid.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 43:30
Attention must be paid! I love it. Well, I am going to link to saltsanity. com. I am going to put that that code, Empty Nest, is going to get folks 15 percent off your already very affordable guide to low sodium eating that has all the links and everything. And I gotta tell you, that's, that's like gold right there. Having those links,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 43:58
It is, and it's why I'm struggling. A lot of the folks who are in my little community or who follow me are a little on the older side. And so they want a paper book. So there's a push. I, I don't want to do it on the computer. I need an actual book, which is great, but I'm like, but I can't, you're not gonna have all the links, but I think I'm gonna figure it out with some QR codes maybe, but yeah.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 44:21
that's smart. That's smart. I, yeah. That's, that's a good idea. You got, oh, look! See? You're technologically savvy. I love it. So
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 44:31
out how to do it, but
Christine Van Bloem (2): 44:34
I, I think you can make a QR code on Bitly.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 44:37
yeah.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 44:38
I think, I forget how I do it. I think that's how I do it. I put QR codes on my business card and I feel so fancy.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 44:44
Good, good.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 44:45
I know, I know.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 44:47
to ask you a question now. Are you And compared to doing, you know, running this school, which I know had to be a ton of work,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 44:53
It was.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 44:54
how are you, are you enjoying the virtual classes just as much? I know it's very different. Yes,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 45:08
like we all did in 2020, and it took, it took me a little while to really embrace it. I do a monthly class with AARP, and Oh! Yay!
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 45:22
did you make? You made focaccia?
Christine Van Bloem (2): 45:24
Oh, the faux gotcha. Isn't that stuff great? I love that. And I teach, typically I'm having four or five hundred people in a class with that. So I've got it. Yeah, but you know, one of the things is when you work with AARP, you know, they are a non profit and they are You know, they have rules, which I completely respect, but I don't talk about my business, I don't talk about my business name, nothing like that with them. I'm really careful because I, I want to be respectful. It's a great relationship, they're fun, but I do, I love the I just love the online because of the folks, you know, I always called it dinner and a show when I had Kitchen Studio because people come in, depending on if it was a, you've taught classes, if it's a Thursday, Friday or Saturday night, they want to come and have fun. That's why they're coming. They're going to cook, but they want to have fun. If it's Saturday morning, they want to learn and have fun. But the learning is more of a thing. This, it's both as well, but the learning I think is easier because I don't have to split the dishes up. It's not like
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 46:41
right,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 46:42
dishes and Team A gets This, and Team B gets that, and then I can answer questions. They're using their own equipment, like I said earlier. I love that, and they can say, Well, I don't have this thing. That's like, no problem, here's what you can do instead.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 47:00
Right, my favorite thing about it, and my own stuff, but I also teach some heart healthy cooking classes virtually for the YMCA. And my favorite thing is that I'm going, I have a class, I'm just going to come in my kitchen. I don't have to pack. I don't have to have a car full of food going anywhere. I love that I can still share, disseminate all that information and not leave my house. We tallied it up and, well, last year, and I think because I used to teach at Le Cademy de Cuisine and some other places as well. And I have taught more than 8, 000 students in over a thousand classes. So I know your number has to be significantly higher than that
Christine Van Bloem (2): 47:36
No! No, no, I'm sure
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 47:38
All day, but it's just it's a nice change. And I remember being like, I'm not doing virtual. I'm not doing that. I don't understand even how that can work. And now I don't know why I didn't do it sooner.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 47:50
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's, well, you know, we learned so much.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 47:54
Yeah. The
Christine Van Bloem (2): 47:58
but we learned, right?
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 47:59
whole pandemic to get me on board. Nice.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 48:11
it. And I find, I call it Cooking Connected. Because, especially as you're getting older, it's, There's less connection, right? And you probably noticed this with your daughter, right? So we would go, both my kids were athletes, so we would go to the softball games, and we'd go to the track meets, and you'd see the parents, the other parents, and you'd chat with them, and it was kind of your getting out and being social for the time.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 48:40
Right, right,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 48:41
they graduate,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 48:43
and you're like, hmm, where'd all those people go?
Christine Van Bloem (2): 48:46
Yeah, and lovely people, but that thread has now been cut and I find that it's, it's really easy to turtle in, right? I, I love turtling in, you know? What's the weather like out there? I haven't been outside all day,
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 49:01
No, I haven't been outside all week,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 49:03
Yeah. Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 49:05
help with that because they were, I was like, I have a Gen X kid, I was a latchkey kid growing up, and it's like, you want me to stay in my house
Christine Van Bloem (2): 49:14
Yeah.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 49:15
and not go, I've trained for this my whole life, like, you know? So,
Christine Van Bloem (2): 49:18
so funny. That's so funny. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I, I love it. I'm glad to hear that you're offering it too. So tell me again, what Wednesday of the month?
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 49:28
The last Wednesday of the month, from 6 to 7, you can find all the information there's a, a page on the saltsanity. com for Low Sodium University, and it's Y O U because it really is all about you and your health. So that's what we want to focus on.
Christine Van Bloem (2): 49:42
Love it. It's so great. Danielle, thank you so much for doing
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 49:45
Thank you! I'm so So thrilled to be here and I love watching you on your Instagram stories. It's like my little, my little, when I take 10 minutes, I'm like, okay, well let's see what everybody's doing on Instagram. So I like seeing what you're, what's going on. And I can't wait to hear about how your, your culinary medicine class is
Christine Van Bloem (2): 50:02
Yeah, I'm really, I'm so interested in it because it, you know, vegan cooking, healthy cooking, diabetic cooking, all of these different things, food, food has such an impact. So I'm excited to dip a toe in it.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 50:17
Good. Going to
Christine Van Bloem (2): 50:19
You'll be able to find all of Danielle's info. I strongly recommend you check out the show notes this week. And of course I'll put it on all of the social, all that good stuff. But thanks Danielle.
Chef Danielle Turner (2): 50:31
You're welcome. Thank you, Christine.
50:33
If you're enjoying the podcast, let me know or better yet. Leave a review on your favorite podcast player. I would so appreciate it. You can find me at Empty Nest Kitchen dot com and as always. I'll see you next week and I'll see in the kitchen.
